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Forfatter Emne: Peter Christian Christensen born Fyen abt. 1867  (Læst 251 gange)
Ron Beck [59196]
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« Dato: 11 Apr 2019 - 10:25 »

My name is Ron Beck - I live in Brisbane, Australia.

My challenge relates to my Wife Cheryl's GGrandfather who was born in Denmark and migrated to Australia. I have tried looking at some Danish records without success.

His name is Peter Christian Christensen (Marriage Certificate 1902 aged 36) or Hans Peter Christian Christensen (Death Certificate 1929 aged 62). I cannot single out with confidence any records in Australia that would give me any information about his travels to Australia. Apart from Marriage, children and Death the only information I have is from his Marriage Certificate (he married in Sydney, Australia) and that he worked as a Chef.

The Marriage Certificate states that he was born Fyen, Denmark and that his parents were Christian Christensen (Carpenter) and Anne Christensen, and that he was 36 years old indicating he was born abt. 1867. This date is supported by his Death Certificate.  I can find no migration records to Australia, but assume he came unaccompanied, likely between 1980 and 1902.

I would be extremely grateful if you could help me in identifying his family background and emigration to Australia.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Best wishes

Ron Beck
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Niels Just Rasmussen [56358]
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« Svar #1 Dato: 13 Apr 2019 - 17:34 »

My name is Ron Beck - I live in Brisbane, Australia.

My challenge relates to my Wife Cheryl's GGrandfather who was born in Denmark and migrated to Australia. I have tried looking at some Danish records without success.

His name is Peter Christian Christensen (Marriage Certificate 1902 aged 36) or Hans Peter Christian Christensen (Death Certificate 1929 aged 62). I cannot single out with confidence any records in Australia that would give me any information about his travels to Australia. Apart from Marriage, children and Death the only information I have is from his Marriage Certificate (he married in Sydney, Australia) and that he worked as a Chef.

The Marriage Certificate states that he was born Fyen, Denmark and that his parents were Christian Christensen (Carpenter) and Anne Christensen, and that he was 36 years old indicating he was born abt. 1867. This date is supported by his Death Certificate.  I can find no migration records to Australia, but assume he came unaccompanied, likely between 1980 and 1902.

I would be extremely grateful if you could help me in identifying his family background and emigration to Australia.

I look forward to hearing from you.

Best wishes

Ron Beck

The problem is that both he and his parents have extremely common names and he might appear in the census with only one of his many first names.


Possible candidates that needs to be investigated further.
There is a Hans Peter Christian Christiansen in the 1880 Census in Svendborg Købstad.
- he is a 14 years old "Lærling" (apprentice) of a bookseller, so is not listed with the parents.
Source: https://www.danishfamilysearch.dk/cid10104358

Have tried to find his birth and confirmation in the church books of the parishes in Svendborg, but not had any luck.

If the father was an actual carpenter (Snedker or Tømrer ?) it could give a hint.

The parents could off course have moved to Fyn or at least the father after becoming a Svend (Journeyman).

NB: The Danish immigration records doesn't list any likely candidate, so he might jumped ship (quite common) or emigrated from Hamburg or Bremen in Germany.
« Sidste ændring: 13 Apr 2019 - 18:04 af Niels Just Rasmussen [56358] » Logget
Niels Just Rasmussen [56358]
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« Svar #2 Dato: 13 Apr 2019 - 18:07 »

Odense Tømrer-laug doesn't have any Christian Christensen.
Source: https://www.sa.dk/ao-soegesider/da/billedviser?epid=17129745#273694,52244883

Odense Snedker Laug have 3, but way to back in time to be relevant.
Source: https://www.sa.dk/ao-soegesider/da/billedviser?epid=17129742#273686,52243482
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Hans Chr. Baagøe [627]
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« Svar #3 Dato: 14 Apr 2019 - 00:00 »

The boy from the census in 1880 in Svendborg is born in Tved close to Svendborg, but the parents names dos not match your information:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-89ZX-HNKS?i=162
He has no. 6 in 1865. Born March 13th. 1865.

His confirmation is no. 14 in 1879 in Svendborg
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-L9ZX-C3CW?i=17

A possible macth:
Birth no. 11 on Nov. 11th. 1867, Vejrup parish, Ribe county (Jutland):
https://www.sa.dk/ao-soegesider/da/billedviser?epid=17127772#171737,28836883

His confirmation in Sørup close to Svendborg on Funen, no. 1881:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QSQ-G9ZX-C4V8?i=503

Parents names matches your information.

Is this your wifes GGFather from Findagrave.com:

Hans P Christensen
Birth    unknown
Death    15 Sep 1929
Burial    
Woronora Memorial Park
Sutherland, Sutherland Shire, New South Wales, Australia
Plot    Anglican Monumental Section 4, Grave 0307
Memorial ID    175643377 · View Source

If you can find the date of birth for him, it will be easyer the find the rigth person, but not always.

Best wishes
Hans Chr. Baagøe


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Ron Beck [59196]
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« Svar #4 Dato: 14 Apr 2019 - 08:49 »

Many thanks to you all for your help.

I do not have his birth date but have ordered a copy of his formal death certificate in the hope this will have the date.  1867 is consistent with his marriage and death information.

He was variously referred to using combinations of his christian names.

Hans - the Findagrave record you list below is the correct person.  He is buried there with his wife Bertha.  I am making inquiries as to whether there is a gravestone and if so what is the inscription.

The only other information I have is that in the 1902 Marriage Record his Father is recorded as a Carpenter deceased and he is listed as a Cook.  At his death in 1929 he is listed as a Chef.

Hans, I cannot read this link - could you please translate.  Birth no. 11 on Nov. 11th. 1867, Vejrup parish, Ribe county (Jutland):
https://www.sa.dk/ao-soegesider/da/billedviser?epid=17127772#171737,28836883

I am very grateful for everyone's help.

Best wishes

Ron Beck
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Niels Just Rasmussen [56358]
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« Svar #5 Dato: 14 Apr 2019 - 12:34 »

If we follow the father - Christen Christensen - of the Hans Peter Christensen, who was born in Vejrup Sogn, Jutland.

Census 1890: Svendborg Amt, Sunds Herred, Sørup Sogn, Sørup Mark, Hus.
Christen Christensen     54     Gift     husfader     daglejer i agerbruget     Snerum sogn  
Anna Olsen     45     Gift     husmoder          Sørup sogn, Svendborg Amt  
Maren Kirstine Christensen     23     Ugift     barn          Vejrup sogn, Ribe Amt  
Karl Vilhelm Christensen     13     Ugift     barn          Sørup sogn, Svendborg Amt  
Kristian Frederik Christensen     10     Ugift     barn          Sørup sogn, Svendborg Amt  
Anders Christensen     6     Ugift     barn          Sørup sogn, Svendborg Amt  
Albert Emil Christensen     3     Ugift     barn          Sørup sogn, Svendborg Amt  
Source: Dansk Demografisk Database. &
Source: https://www.danishfamilysearch.dk/cid12031712

So the father is born in "Sneum Sogn" in Ribe Amt. He is an agricultural worker [no proof yet as carpenter].
Anna Olsen is a local from Sørup Sogn.
Daughter Maren Kirstine is born in Vejrup [just as Hans Peter].
Rest of the children born in Sørup.

Sørup Parish Churchbook:
Christen Christensen. Arbejdsmand i Sørup. [still nothing about being a carpenter].
Died: 10th of May 1890.
Buried: 15th of May 1890.
Age: 54 years [fits with the 1890 census].
Source: https://www.sa.dk/ao-soegesider/da/billedviser?epid=17138575#181627,30837112
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Hans Chr. Baagøe [627]
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« Svar #6 Dato: 14 Apr 2019 - 14:36 »

Birth record for Hans Peter Christensen in Vejrup parish:

Hans Peter Christensen, born Nov. 11th. 1867
Christened in the church: Febr. 9th 1868

Parents:
hmd. (smallholder) Christen Christensen
og hustru (and wife) Ane Olesen
af (from) Grisbek, 24 Aar (years old)

sponsors:
hmd. (smallholder) Christen Madsens kone (wife)
Kjersten af (from) Terpling, Christen
Madsen, ibd. (same place), hmd. (smallholder) Jens Christian
Thomsen, Grisbekborg, gmd. (farmer)
Christen Jørgensen, Sudderkrog,
aftmd. (retired) Jens Christensen, Grisbek

The places in the record are in the lower left part of this map:
https://hkpn.gst.dk/mapviewer.aspx?type=lkMaalebordsblade&id=10628
The map is from 1870 and corrected in 1909.

Census 1880 in Sørup:

Samtlige personer i husstanden

Svendborg, Sunds, Sørup, Sørup By, huus, 3 F3, FT-1880, C6584
Navn:     Alder:     Status:     Stilling i familien:     Erhverv:     Fødested:
Christen Christensen     44     Gift      arbeidsmand ved agerbruget, husfader            Ribe Amt 
Ane Christensen født Olsen     36     Gift      hans kone            her i sognet [Sørup] 
Maren Kirstine Christensen     13     Ugift      deres datter            Ribe Amt 
Hans Peder Christensen     11     Ugift      deres søn            do [Ribe Amt] 
Niels Christensen     9     Ugift      deres søn            Hjallese sogn, Odense Amt [Dalum] 
Petrine Christensen     8     Ugift      deres datter            Eiby sogn, Odense Amt 
Lauritz Christensen     7     Ugift      deres søn            Eiby sogn, Odense Amt 
Carl Christensen     3     Ugift      deres søn            her i sognet [Sørup] 
Jens Christensen     5     Ugift      deres søn            St. Hans sogn, Odense Amt 
Christian Frederik Christensen     1     Ugift      deres søn            her i sognet [Sørup] 
 
Christen Christen is listed as farmhand, smallholder and laubour in the records, I have found. I have not seen him listed as carpenter.

Best wishes
Hans Chr. Baagøe
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Hans Chr. Baagøe [627]
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« Svar #7 Dato: 14 Apr 2019 - 19:03 »

I have tried to follow Hans Peter from Vejrup in the military records, and traced him to Vejlby parish close to Fredericia, Jutland.

He married in Vejlby in 1889:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QSQ-G94D-893Q?i=113&cc=2078555

I was able to trace him until the census in 1930, where he was at the hospital in Fredericia:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSLH-23MT-S?i=881&cc=2800932

This found indicates, that he was not your wifes ancestor, you are looking for!

Best wishes
Hans Chr. Baagøe
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Niels Just Rasmussen [56358]
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« Svar #8 Dato: 14 Apr 2019 - 19:14 »

There is another Hans Peter Christian Christiansen listed as 3 years old in the 1870 Census.

Kvong [Qvong] Sogn, Ribe Amt.
Source: https://www.danishfamilysearch.dk/cid14984340

It is not him either as his father is a Søren Nielsen Christiansen.
Source: https://www.danishfamilysearch.dk/sogn1202/churchbook/source143287/opslag16012614
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Ron Beck [59196]
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« Svar #9 Dato: 16 Apr 2019 - 07:04 »

Thank you both very much again

I have now obtained a copy of the Death Certificate.  Unfortunately it does not include his birth date, only his age - 62.  It does include two new pieces of information:

1.  It states that he was born in Svendborg, Fyn, Denmark, and

2.  He had been in N. S. W. (New South Wales, Australia) about 33 years.  That is, he arrived N.S.W about 1896 and married some 6 years later.

I have quickly looked for immigration information and naturalisation but so far no success.  I will keep looking.

Am I correct in concluding that, unfortunately at this stage, you can find no evidence of a possible Hans/ Peter/ Christian Christensen born/ christened around Svendborg abt 1867?

Many thanks again - I will keep looking.

Best wishes

Ron
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Hans Chr. Baagøe [627]
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« Svar #10 Dato: 16 Apr 2019 - 10:32 »

I have been looking in both Odense and Svendborg county, which includes the island of Funen, for a possible match. The city of Svendborg was at that time only 3 parishes.

Until now, there has been no match, if the given name of the father includes Christen/Christian and the name of the mother includes Ane/Anne/Anna.

He is not in the birth registers nor in the confirmation registers from Svendborg in the period 1866 to 1868 with the match of the given names of the parents.


Best wishes
Hans Chr. Baagøe
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Niels Just Rasmussen [56358]
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« Svar #11 Dato: 16 Apr 2019 - 12:36 »

As it says he was from Svendborg Fyn - it could just mean Svendborg Amt [Country].

The Islands of Tåsinge, Langeland and Ærø [and some other smaller islands] were included in Svendborg Country.
Langeland was the area of Denmark where the highest % of the population emigrated, so it could be that he is from some of these Islands south of Fyn proper.
After his confirmation he could have travelled to Svendborg and been living there until he chose to emigrate.
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Ron Beck [59196]
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« Svar #12 Dato: 17 Apr 2019 - 08:52 »

I appreciate the effort you both have put into this.

It seems that his origins will remain a mystery.  I assume that if he was born and confirmed on one of the smaller islands that he would appear in the Svendborg parish records.

Unless he was trying to disguise his origins, I have most confidence in the information he personally provided for his marriage certificate in 1902.  That is:

- he was 36 yrs old meaning he was born about 1866/1867
- he was born Fyen, Denmark
- his parents were Christian (deceased Carpenter) and Anne

The other information may be correct but it is second hand after his death.

At this stage I can do no more than thank you fellows for your help

Best wishes

Ron
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Hans Chr. Baagøe [627]
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« Svar #13 Dato: 18 Apr 2019 - 00:49 »

I have checked the church records for birth and confirmation from: Svendborg, Nyborg, Stenstrup, Kirkeby, Tved, Sørup, Egense, Thurø, Bregninge, Landet, Kværndrup, Brudager, Ringe, Ollerup, Gudbjerg, Vester Skerninge, Øster Skerninge, Lunde, Drejø, Strynø, Avernakø and Bjerreby.

Most of the parishes are close to Svendborg.

You can see the locations on this map:
https://www.slaegtogdata.dk/kilder/sognekort/svendborg-amt

When a possible match was found, I could either find them dead i Denmark or living in Denmark after 1906.

If he was born on a small island, he would be in the local parish register.

If you can find and old letter or picture from some of his relatives in Denmark, it can also be a help. Perhaps one in your wifes family has the missing information. The information in an old letter could be in old danish handwriting.


Best wishes
Hans Chr. Baagøe






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Ron Beck [59196]
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« Svar #14 Dato: 18 Apr 2019 - 06:31 »

Thanks Hans for your further efforts.

I will keep looking

All the best to you and yours

Ron

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