Looking for my grandfathers name and maybe family

Startet af Oliver Schaper, 06 Jul 2014 - 18:31

Forrige emne - Næste emne

Oliver Schaper

Hi all!

Maybe someone around can help me with finding the name of my Danish grandfather.

My grandmother Helene Therese Krause resided in the refugee camp Gedhus near Karup after World War II. At that time she was somehow together with a Danish guy who later became my grandfather - unfortunately I don't know his name and they were never married. His name is not mentionend on the certficates my mother has... bad luck.

However - on the 5th of May 1946 my mother Sylvia Karla Krause (Krause was my grandmas maiden name) was born in Gedhus and baptized in Assing Kirke / Kibaek on 28th of July 1946.

Sometime later my grandma returned to Germany while my grandfather stayed in Denmark. So it might be that he founded a Danish family afterwards. I would really to like find the name of my grandfather and - if possible - get in contact with the maybe existing family.

Thanks a lot in advance for any help.

Best greetings from Germany,
Oliver

PB

Hi,

there is an archive having the names of all the refugees, you can find it in Daisy, and I do not think it is online:

Arkivskaber:
Lejrene for tyske flygtninge 1944-50. Grove-Gedhus flygtningelejres arkiv 

"Giver oplysning om fødselsdag, -år, -sted, sidste opholdssted inden flugten samt om omflytningen i danske lejre og dato for hjemrejse. "


Also if she was born in the camp, the birth should be registered in the churchrecords (www.arkivarlieronline.dk).
I have tried to look for your data, but without any luck.

you can try the parish "Simmelkjær" here you find several children born in "Flygtningelejren Gedhus pr. Karup". I do not find anny with the names you mention.
In these records it also states if the parents were married and who the father was and where he was living.

It was forbidden for the danes to have any contact with the refugees, I have read, so it might be the reason for why they were not married, and the name of the father was not on the certificate.

Hope this can give you a hint to go on in your search.

Pia








Oliver Schaper

#2
Hi!

Unfortunately I can´t find something in the archives related to "Simmelkjær" - but it´s good hint anyway. I will check other archived books as well, maybe I can find something somewhere.

Anyway it would be great if someone has some additional ideas or hints.

Ah btw... if someone reads this and recalls stories from his/her father or grandfather. My mother was the fourth child of my grandmother. At that time she already had two sons and one daughter named Roger, Klaus and Elke. Klaus died at the age of six because of a bad head injury he got from an accident where a truck was involved. Klaus´ grave can be found on Karup refugee graveyard. Well, maybe someone heard about those names from someone. I hope so...

Thanks a lot and best regards,
Oliver

Inger Toudal

Hi Oliver,

Maybe you can find Klaus' death record at Arkivalieronline www.sa.dk/content/dk/ao-forside/find_kirkeboger

- Amt: Ringkøbing
- Herred: Hammerum
- Sogn: Simmelkjær 1946 - 1948

Death records are at the end of each book, first males Døde Mandkøn, then females Døde Kvindekøn.

The Grove-Gedhus refugee camps archives can be found at the Provincial Archives of Northern Jutland in Viborg:

http://www.sa.dk/content/dk/daisy/arkivskabers_arkivserier?a=&b=&c=gedhus&d=1&e=2014&f=&g=&h=&ngid=566863&ngnid=566865&heid=&henid=&epid=&faid=&meid=&m2rid=&side=&sort=&dir=&gsc=&int=&ep=&es=&ed=

Best regards,
Inger Toudal
Venlig hilsen
Inger Toudal

Oliver Schaper

Hi Inger and thanks for that additional link.

Anyway - the grave of Klaus, who was my uncle, is not the problem. I found a record in a book at the refugee graveyard in Oksbøl last month which reads that the grave is in Karup. I visited that grave the following week. Was there with my mother who is the (half-)sister of Klaus - we both were there for the very first time (he died in 1946) because we did not know where his grave was and if there is a grave at all. Damn, that were some heavy feelings.

Afterwards my mother told me that her father was a Danish guy, so that´s what I am after right now - finding the name of my grandfather and maybe some siblings of him. That would be really great.

Mange hilsner fra Tyskland,
Oliver

PB

If you live so near that you can visit then go to the archive in Viborg, they have the cards with names on for families, there you can find your grandmother and her children.

Do you have the names and birthdates on the other children ?

You are also welcome to send the documents that you have where it states the baptizm of your mother in Hassing. Since it is about living people do not post it here but send it to danishgenealogist@yahoo.com and I will have a look at it. Can you try to ask your mother what was the occupation of the danish grandfather you are looking for - did he work in the camp ?

Best regards
Pia

Gitte Johansen

#6
Klaus Hoppe.

http://www.dki-01.dk/fl_gedhus/

[vedhæfting slettet af admin]
Venlig hilsen
Gitte Johansen 8520 Lystrup

gittejohansen(snabel a)rocketmail.com

Oliver Schaper

Hi Gitte and Pia!

Yes Gitte... Hoppe is the last name of my mothers half-brothers and -sister, because that was the name of their father from whom my grandmother was already divorced at the time my mother was born. I don't really know if my grandma called herself Hoppe or Krause in those days - so maybe if she is not listed as Helene Therese Krause somewhere she might can be found as Helene Therese Hoppe.

And I visited that grave in June as I wrote above, but anyway - thank you a lot, Gitte. I really appreciate any help and any effort in helping me forward. I means a lot to me.

Pia - thanks for your help also. Will get a copy of my mothers certificates tomorrow I guess, so I can scan them into my PC and mail them to you. A big thank you in advance to you also.

And - unfortunately - I'm not living in Denmark, but I plan to do so as soon as possible. Somehow I kind of felt at home when I visited Denmark in 2009 for the first time after nearly 30 years. Maybe due to the roots I'm now after...

But for now I'm living in Germany and I visit Denmark at least once a year.

Best wishes and take care,
Oliver

Oliver Schaper

Ah... just have seen a mistake of mine... Klaus died at the age of four. He was born in 1942 and died in 1946 - shortly after my mother was born. Stupid me... ;)

Inger Toudal

#9

I was wondering why I couldn't find the birth record, or the death record in the church book for the Grove-Gedhus refugee camp, so I did a search on the Internet, and came up with this:

There was a small refugee camp in Kibæk, too, with about 400 refugees, from 1944-1948:

http://kibaeks.blogspot.com/2011/11/et-tilbageblik-over-assing-sogn-kibk-by.html - info at the bottom of the page.

The church records for the camp are not online, I believe, only at the Archives in Viborg:

http://www.sa.dk/content/dk/daisy/arkivskabers_arkivserier?a=&b=&c=assing+sogn&d=1&e=2014&f=&g=&h=&ngid=534709&ngnid=534711&heid=&henid=&epid=&faid=&meid=&m2rid=&side=&sort=&dir=&gsc=&int=&ep=&es=&ed= - the 1946 - 1946 records

Since your mother was baptized in Assing church, maybe she was born in the Kibæk camp? There is some distance from Grove and Simmelkær to Assing, as you can see on this map: http://www.dis-danmark.dk/kort/kortring.htm

German refugees and soldiers were buried at 475 Danish graveyards, but in the 1960's it was decided to transfer the graves to 34 graveyards, so Klaus may initially have been buried in Assing.

http://www.karup-by.dk/krigsgrave.htm

Best regards,
Inger T.
Venlig hilsen
Inger Toudal

Inger Buchard

Til orientering - Oliver har fået besked direkte:

Kilden skal findes i
C 520 C. Assing præstearkiv

8. Registreringsprotokol for flygtninge i lejren i Kibæk 1946, 1 bd.
Indhold:
Fødte, konfirmerede, døde

Inger
Redaktør på DIS-Wiki

Inger Toudal


Tak for orienteringen. Det var jo det, jeg skrev i går.

Inger T.
Venlig hilsen
Inger Toudal

Oliver Schaper

Hi again!

Yes, that was real good help so far - now I am impatiently waiting for any news from Viborg and/or Copenhagen.

Again thanks all for the effort so far. I can´t find the matching words to say how thankful I am already now. Not to mention how thankful I will be if there´s some good news that will lead me to my - maybe existing - Danish relatives...

Will keep you up to date... promised.

Best regards,
Oliver

Oliver Schaper

#13
Hi all!

Looks like things are progressing. :)

I got mail today from Viborg (Landsarkivet for Nørrejylland) and they found entries related to my mother's birth within the "Registreringsprotokol for flygtninge" and also some entries related to my uncles father, Hermann Hoppe.

They will send me copies of the registration cards to me by snail mail.

I really hope that those cards contain information about my grandfather's name (and maybe location, profession or something). Will keep you informed on this.

One more question - my mother spoke to my uncle a few days ago and he said that they left Kibæk already in 1947. They headed for a town up north called "Ryæ" or something like that. Someone knows that place? Could not find it on Google Maps. Maybe that's the home town/place of my grandfather... who knows?!

Take care all and best regards,
Oliver

Edit : Maybe that place is "Ryde"? That's just about 65km away from Kibæk.

Oliver Schaper

Hi all!

Finally I got the copies of the requested pages from the church books - thanks a lot to Viborg archives.

Unfortunately they don't mention the name of my grandfather, which is quite sad.  :-\

Anyway - I must admit that I have some trouble reading the handwriting. Maybe someone with a little bit more experience in this can help me with the text? Would be great, so thanks in advance.

Additionally I think not having the name of my grandfather here is not what I was hoping. I fear that this may lead to a dead end. Any ideas anyone? I feel a bit stuck right now unfortunately.

Thanks a lot and best regards,
Oliver


[vedhæfting slettet af admin]

Oliver Schaper

Additionally I received the entry of Klaus' death. Maybe someone can translate that to clear text for me? I would really appreciate that.

Thanks and take care,
Oliver

[vedhæfting slettet af admin]

Oliver Schaper

Another thing : As I was told by my uncle, my grandmother moved to a refugee camp in Ry near Aarhus in 1947 before returning to Germany in 1948. He also said that the surname of my grandfather might be something like Petersen or Pedersen - but I guess that's a quite common name in Denmark.

Please find attached I picture which was taken on the 18th of August 1946. It shows my grandma Helene together with my uncles Roger (upper left), Klaus (lower left, the one who unfortunately died a few months after this picture was taken), my aunt Elke (right side) and the little child in the middle is my mother Sylvia.

Maybe someone has seen this or a similar picture before. Just a little straw I'm grabbing... but who knows?!

Thanks a lot,
Oliver


[vedhæfting slettet af admin]

Mette Lund

Hi Oliver,

Here is most of the first text - missing a couple of names.

1946
5. Maj

Flygtningesyge-
huset
i Gedhus
pr. Karup

Sylvia
Karla
Krause

Fru Helene Therese
Hoppe f. Krause af
Berlin 017 p.t. Kibæk
FLygtningelejr, Assing Sogn.
Født d. 2. Januar 1907 i
Wargitten, Østprøjsen.

1946
28. Juli

Sognepræst Anders Maar-
bjerg, Assing pr. Kibæk,
evangelisk
i
Flygtningelejren Kibæk
Assing Sogn.

Manfred M????
Frk. Lisbeth Matthi????
begge i Kibæk Lejren.

Attester: Fødselsanmeldelse
fra Gedhus og fra Moderen,
samt hendes Stambog.
Moderen er tysk og evangelist

Best regards,
Mette
Med venlig hilsen

Mette Lund
Moderator

Oliver Schaper

Hi again!

It seems that I am a bit stuck... I don't really know how to continue after stumbling through the WWW for a couple of weeks/months now.

The only option that I haven't checked yet is my aunt Elke, which I haven't met for about 35 years - unfortunately. But as she is a little bit younger than my uncle Roger and he couldn't recall to many details. Maybe she can, maybe she can't. Will check out as soon as possible.

Any hints on how to continue with this if my aunt Elke doesn't remember helpful details?

It would be very sad to see this story to go into a dead end street. I always felt that there is some kind of connection to Denmark and now as I know there is... I can't get any more details. :(

Help of any kind is really appreciated.

Thanks a lot and take care all,
Oliver