Missing: Hansine Iversen born 9 Sept 1850

[Susanne Larson]

Hi, this is my first post. I am American living in Australia with some Danish, but thought I would start on this forum. I am seeking Hansine Iversen.

I have her wedding certificate and life documented from that point. But I can not find her in Denmark. I looked through all the census material and do not know where to go next. I also have looked on Ancestry and FamilySearch.

She was married in Sweden on 30 July 1880 to Per Larsson at Hassleholm 88, Stoby Parish, Skone, Sweden.

Her birthdate was listed as 25 Sept 1850.

One Swedish record had her born in Ringkobing.

Any help would be much appreciated.

thanks
Susanne

[Pamela Alley]

Hi Susanne

You gave two different dates of birth, 9 Sept 1850 and 25 Sept 1850.

I found a Hansine Iversen born 25 Sept 1850 in Rudkøbing, Svendborg to mother fruentimmer Kirstine Marie Iversen and alleged father Daniel Hansen from Lindelse sogn. The record is found in Rudkøbing, Svendborg (new version) 1850-1865, ops 117. If this is the correct Hansine Iversen:

Kirstine (Kirsten) Marie is found in the 1850 census in Herslev, Lindelse, Svendborg working for Daniel Hansen's mother Marthe Klausdatter

All persons in the household

Svendborg, Langelands Sønder, Lindelse, Herslev By, et Hus, 114, FT-1850, D2994
Name:     Age:     Marital status:       Position in household:       Occupation:       Birth place:
Marthe Klausdatter    53    Enke       Husmoder, lever af sin Jordlod    *her i Sognet
Daniel Hansen    25    Ugift       hendes Barn, Skomager    *her i Sognet
Kristian Hansen    23    Ugift       hendes Barn, Smed    *her i Sognet
Klaus Hansen    20    Ugift       hendes Barn, Skomager    *her i Sognet
Frederik Hansen    13    Ugift       hendes Barn    *her i Sognet
Kirsten Marie Iversen    33    Ugift       Tjenestepige    Leierskov, Ribe Amt

Daniel Hansen is found in Lindelse, Svendborg (new version) 1821-1843, ops 16, born 27 Feb 1825 to parents Hans Steffensen and Marte Klausdatter.

Hans Rasmussen Stephansen is found dead in Lindelse (new version) 1843-1892, ops 3 on 8 Oct 1843, age 54.

This may be him in the 1801 Lindelse census with his parents and siblings:

All persons in the household

Svendborg, Langelands Sønder, Lindelse, Lindelse Bye, , 42, FT-1801, B6492
Name:     Age:     Marital status:       Position in household:       Occupation:       Birth place:
Stephen Hansen    40    Gift    mand    indsidder og skoeflikker    
Catrine Pauline Rasmusdatter    39    Gift    hans kone       
Sinne Kirstine Stephensdatter    14    Ugift    deres børn       
Hans Rasmusen Stephensen    12    Ugift    deres børn       
Christian Stephensen    10    Ugift    deres børn       
Rasmus Stephensen    8    Ugift    deres børn       
Mads Stephensen    5    Ugift    deres børn       
Jacob Stephensen    2    Ugift    deres børn

And this may be Marte Klausdatter with her mother, brother and grandparents in the 1801 Lindelse census:

All persons in the household

Svendborg, Langelands Sønder, Lindelse, Illebølle Bye, , 19, FT-1801, B6492
Name:     Age:     Marital status:       Position in household:       Occupation:       Birth place:
Daniel Jørgensen    63    Gift    mand    skoleholder    
Maren Jørgensdatter    66    Gift    hans kone       
Kirsten Danielsdatter    28    Gift    deres datter    manden i fast tieneste i et andet sogn    
Marte Klausdatter    3    Ugift    hendes børn       
Jørgen Daniel Klausen    1    Ugift    hendes børn

Kirsten Marie is found in Lejrskov, Ribe 1814-1825 (new version), ops 33, born 11 March 1817 to parents Iver Gertzen and Else Maria Christensdatter.

The 1850 Lejrskov census shows Iver Geertsen born about 1780 in Vorbasse, Ribe and Else Maria born about 1788 in Lejrskov. Use census information as a guideline. Ages, etc.. are often incorrect.

All persons in the household

Ribe, Anst, Lejrskov, Lejrskov by, Et hus, 26, FT-1850, B6236
Name:     Age:     Marital status:       Position in household:       Occupation:       Birth place:
Iver Geertsen    70    Gift       Husmand, kurvemager    Vorbasse sogn, Ribe amt
Else Marie Christensen    62    Gift       Hans kone    Her i sognet [Lejrskov sogn]

This may be Else Marie Christensdatter in the 1801 Lejrskov census with her parents and siblings:

All persons in the household

Ribe, Anst, Lejrskov, Leirschov Bye, , 3. fam, FT-1801, B9148
Name:     Age:     Marital status:       Position in household:       Occupation:       Birth place:
Christen Jensen    49    Gift    Huusbonde    Sognefoged, Lægdsmand og Gaardbeboer    
Karen Hansdatter    35    Gift    Hans Kone       
Else Marie Christensdatter    14    Ugift    Deres Børn       
Hans Christensen    12    Ugift    Deres Børn       
Mette Christensdatter    4    Ugift    Deres Børn       
Anne Malene Christensdatter    1    Ugift    Deres Børn

I didn't see Iver Geertsen in the 1787 Vorbasse census, but this may be him in Skovbølling, Aastrup

All persons in the household

Ribe, Gørding, Aastrup, Skovbølling, , 4, FT-1787, C1745
Name:     Age:     Marital status:       Position in household:       Occupation:       Birth place:
Niels Pedersen    34    Gift    Mand    IInderste og lever af aftægt    
Maren Mortensdatter    60    Gift    Hans Kone       
Ivar Girtzen    10    Ugift    Dreng

And here he is a widower in 1860 Lejrskov

All persons in the household

Ribe, Anst, Lejrskov, ??...skov Gaard, Et Hus, 69, FT-1860, B6498
Name:     Age:     Marital status:       Position in household:       Occupation:       Birth place:
Iver Geertsen    82    Enke    Husmand. husfader       Vorbasse sogn, Ribe amt
Karen Iversdatter    33    Ugift    Hans datter       I sognet [Lejrskov sogn, Ribe amt]
Iverine Marie Iversen    2    Ugift    Husfaderens datterdatter       Do [Lejrskov sogn]

Daniel Hansen in the 1880 census, married and with another child, living in Sønder Longelse, Longelse, Svendborg.

All persons in the household

Svendborg, Langelands Sønder, Longelse, Sønder Longelse, Longelse sogn, et hus, 15, FT-1880, C6597
Name:     Age:     Marital status:       Position in household:       Occupation:       Birth place:
Daniel Hansen    54    Gift    husfader, husmand       Lindelse sogn
Bodil Kirstine Hansen    49    Gift    hans kone       Longelse sogn
Marthe Hansen    6    Ugift    deres barn       do [Longelse sogn]

I hope this helps and you're able to connect this family to the Hansine Iversen you're looking for. Good luck

Regards,

Pam Alley

[Susanne Larson]

Dear Pam,

As my children would say, "OMG". This is brilliant! Yes sorry about the confusion on the birthdate - it is the 25 September 1850 - I must have started to use numbers in the heading and messed up.

I think this must be her:
Right date
I did have a Rudkobing somewhere.

And also some people in my family tree thought her maiden name was Hansen. However I have been using Iversen as that is what is on her marriage certificate.

So, the old son of the household and the maid story.....

I wonder how I enter that onto my Ancestry tree? Do you have any idea how it worked in Denmark at the time if the father is listed as "alleged"?

Thanks so much!
Susanne

[Pamela Alley]

Hi Susanne

I really don't know what the responsibilities of the father would be. One of the Danes on the forum may be able to answer that. Their level of expertise far surpasses mine. I believe the parish the mother lived in 10 months prior to the birth was ultimately responsible for paying relief to the mother when necessary.

Regards

Pam

[Otto Kjærgaard]

I found the birth records in Rudkøbing Parish.

Her mother was unmarried from Rudkøbing Kirstine Marie Iversen

Her father was Daniel Hansen
from Lindelse sogn (parish)

[vedhæfting slettet af admin]

[Otto Kjærgaard]

second page of the birth record

[vedhæfting slettet af admin]

[Susanne Larson]

Thank you both very much. Now I just curious what they did between 1850-1880.....

[Helmer Christiansen]

... what the responsibilities of the father would be.
...

From http://www.statensnet.dk/pligtarkiv/fremvis.pl?vaerkid=44&reprid=0&filid=4&iarkiv=1

"Regulation of 14 October 1763 on maintenance of illegitimate children"  introduced the father's duty to provide for children born out of wedlock in Danish law. Regulation of 1763 stipulated that the father of the illegitimate child "as well as the mother (should) care to its upbringing and after his terms and fortune to pay at least half of these costs." That regulation also gave special coercive means to secure its contribution recovery. Although the regulation of 1763 ruled the father's maintenance obligation towards illegitimate children, it was still more of a drafting of already prevailing legal situation than an innovation. Regulation of 1763 only obliged the father to contribute to a scantily maintenance for the child until its 10th year.

[Otto Kjærgaard]

Before 1860  Stoby was small village and parish. Hässleholm was just a farm in Stoby parish.

I 1860 the first railroad cam to Hässleholm and in 1875 a crossing railroad came.

I would make a search in the swedish archives an look for people who  moved to the area when the railroad came.

----------

Hansine had a halfsister born in Lejrskov Iverine Marie Iversen

Ribe, Anst, Lejrskov, ??...skov Gaard, Et Hus, 69, FT-1860, B6498
Name:     Age:     Marital status:       Position in household:       Occupation:       Birth place:
Iver Geertsen    82    Enke    Husmand. husfader       Vorbasse sogn, Ribe amt
Karen Iversdatter    33    Ugift    Hans datter       I sognet [Lejrskov sogn, Ribe amt]
Iverine Marie Iversen     2    Ugift    Husfaderens datterdatter       Do [Lejrskov sogn]

Iverine Marie Iversen was born June 19 in Lejrskov, her mother was unmarried . The father was a farmhand Hans Poulsen working at a farm called Noesgaard or Noergaard.

[Inger Toudal]

The mother of Iverine Marie Iversen b. 1858 is Karen Iversdatter (Lejrskov 1850-1864 (ny), opslag 83).

By 1860 Daniel Hansen had moved to Longelse parish and was still unmarried:

Svendborg, Langelands Sønder, Longelse, Longelse, et huus, 19, FT-1860, B0500
Name:     Age:     Marital status:       Pos. in household:       Occupation:       Birth plac
Søren Jensen    49    Gift    indsidder, huusfader, dagleier       Tullebølle sogn, Svendborg Amt
Anne Marie Larsen    49    Gift    hans kone       Lindelse sogn, Svendborg Amt
Frederik Anton Sørensen    10    Ugift    deres børn       her i sognet [Longelse]
Rasmus Larsen Sørensen    6    Ugift    deres børn       do [Longelse]
Daniel Hansen    35    Ugift    huuseier, skomager       Lindelse sogn, Svendborg Amt

Maybe he never acknowledged the paternity of Hansine Iversen, since she didn't get his surname?

Could this be Kirsten Marie with the age wrong?

Svendborg, Langelands Sønder, Humble, Humble skoledistrikt, ??...gaard, en Gaard, 67, FT-1860, B7038
Name:     Age:     Marital status:       Pos. in household:       Occupation:       Birth place:
Dorthea Larsen    83    Enke    Lever af sin Gaard       Lindelse S. Sv. Amt
- - - - -
Marie Kirstine Iversen??    29    Ugift    Tjenestefolk       Leierskov??
- - - - -

Maybe it's worth checking the original census at http://www.sa.dk/content/dk/ao-forside/find_folketallinger
- and the departure and arrival lists (Tilgangsliste & Afgangsliste) in the relevant church books.

Best regards,
Inger Toudal

[Otto Kjærgaard]

I agrre thats an good idea to check departure and arrival lists (Tilgangsliste & Afgangsliste) in the relevant church books.

I can be hard to find the right persons there since you dont know arrival and departure year , but you might find useful information.

[Kaj Arne Jørgensen]

I have now collected information about Kirsten Marie Iversdatter, and I know that Susanne Larson has information on Ancestry for the daughter Hansine Iversen when she was married in Sweden, and her life in USA, and I will ask Susanne what information she now is missing for these persons ?

Thanks for all the information I have got here to do my further investigation to help Susanne.


Kirsten Marie Iversdatter

Birth
1817
11 Mar
Lejrskov, Ribe, Denmark
Kirkebog Lejrskov opslag 31

Christening
1817
2 May
Lejrskov, Ribe, Denmark
Kirkebog Lejrskov opslag 31

Census
1834
Age: 17
Lejrskov, Ribe, Denmark
Ribe, Anst, Lejrskov, Ferup bye, En gård, 20, FT-1834, B5906

Census
1840
Age: 23
Lejrskov, Ribe, Denmark
Ribe, Anst, Lejrskov, Feerup Bye, 5, en Gaard, 93, FT-1840, A3324

Census
1845
Age: 28
Lindelse, Denmark
Svendborg, Langelands Sønder, Lindelse, Vindebye, En gaard, 60, FT-1845, B7130

Census
1850
Age: 33
Lindelse, Denmark
Svendborg, Langelands Sønder, Lindelse, Herslev By, et Hus, 114, FT-1850, D2994

Census
1860
1 Feb
Age: 42
Humble, Denmark
Svendborg, Langelands Sønder, Humble, Humble skoledistrikt, ??...gaard, en Gaard, 67, FT-1860, B7038

Marriage to Claus Henrik Theodor Ehlers
1860
27 Oct
Age: 43
Humble, Denmark
Kirkebog Humble opslag 17

Residence
1864
Oct
Age: 47
Rudkøbing, Denmark

Census
1880
1 Feb
Age: 62
Rudkøbing, Denmark
Svendborg, Langelands Nørre, Rudkøbing Købstad, Rudkjøbing, Nørrestræde 23, 25, 26, forh. stuen, 1 F4, FT-1880, C6575

Death
1880
26 Nov
Age: 63
Rudkøbing, Denmark
Kirkebog Rudkøbing opslag 157

Burial
1880
1 Dec
Rudkøbing, Denmark
Kirkebog Rudkøbing opslag 157

.................................................................................
She was married to weaver

Claus Henrik Theodor Ehlers

Birth
1823
21 Nov
Preetz, Plon, Schleswig-Holstein, Germany

Census
1860
1 Feb
Age: 36
Lindelse, Denmark
Svendborg, Langelands Sønder, Lindelse, Hennetved By, et huus, 20, FT-1860, B0499

Marriage to Kirsten Marie Iversdatter
1860
27 Oct
Age: 36
Humble, Denmark
Kirkebog Humble opslag 17

Residence
1864
Oct
Age: 40
Rudkøbing, Denmark

Census
1880
Age: 57
Rudkøbing, Denmark
Svendborg, Langelands Nørre, Rudkøbing Købstad, Rudkjøbing, Nørrestræde 23, 25, 26, forh. stuen, 1 F4, FT-1880, C6575

Census
1890
Age: 67
Rudkøbing, Denmark
Svendborg, Langelands Nørre, Rudkøbing Købstad, Rudkjøbing Kjøbstad, Nørrestræde, forhus stuen, 2, FT-1890, B0660

Death
1892
11 Dec
Age: 69
Rudkøbing, Denmark
Kirkebog Rudkøbing opslag 14

Burial
1892
15 Dec
Rudkøbing, Denmark
Kirkebog Rudkøbing opslag 14

[Susanne Larson]

Dear all,

Thank you so very much. This has been the most fun.  (I must not have an exciting life, as I kept thinking about it all night.) It is like having a team of detectives. 

I have entered all of the information I think into my Ancestry tree:

http://trees.ancestry.com.au/tree/1845358/person/-688128769

I was just thinking that because I have a long-lived family, Hansine was my great-grandmother; she only died 6 months before my father was born.

I am interested in the fact that on this side of the family (father's) and on my mother's side (Rasmus Olesen (1831-1907 Grejs, Vejle) there are several instances of fostering children. Obviously with shorter life expectancies - and illegitimacy - society worked differently.

Anyway, mange tak!  Now I shall hunt for photos. But I feel they may be of houses vs people - I get the feeling the photos do not exist as much of the peasants vs the landowners! 

Susanne

[John Wrenholt]

In the 1855 and 1860 censuses, Hansine is listed as Hansine Danielsen.  In the 1855 census (which is online but hasn't been transcribed yet) she is listed as a pleiedatter and living with Joh Anton Diechmann and his wife.  (ops 37)

Here she is in the 1860 census:
svendborg, Langelands Sønder, Lindelse, Vindebye, et huus, 79 F2, FT-1860, B0499
Name:    Age:    Marital status:    Position in household:    Occupation:    Birth place:
Kirsten Hansdatter   60   Enke(mand)   huusmandsenke, spinderske      her i sognet [Lindelse]
Johanne Marie Pedersen   29   Enke(mand)   hendes datter, syerske      do [Lindelse]
Hansine Danielsen   10   Ugift   deres pleiedatter      Rudkjøbing

She is confirmed at the age of 14 in 1864.  (1862-1891 Lindelse, Langeland Sønder, Svendborg (ny) ops 63). 

[Inger Toudal]

Interesting that, although her official surname is Iversen (seen both at baptism, confirmation, and marriage),
she's listed in the 1855 and 1860 censuses with the surname Danielsen, which would be her patronymic,
as the alleged father is Daniel Hansen.

Inger T.

[Susanne Larson]

Yes - and why in the US there some confusion about what her last name was.....

[Flemming Kristensen]

Hi Susanne
Here's what I have in my database. Unfortunately, I have not read it through due to time constraints. But should be correct.

For many years researching Langeland and my ancestors there.

Have unfortunately no access to Ancestry, so I can not see your data.


Med venlig hilsen
Flemming Kristensen

[vedhæfting slettet af admin]

[Susanne Larson]

Hi Fleming.  This is amazing. I am about half way of entering it into my ancestry.com page.

What a lot of work you have done.  It is great to be able to piggyback on top of it.

Much appreciated.

Cheers
Susanne